[epub] Re: In response to "Tombo" and the benefits of Spamcop

[Frank Garon <webmaster@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

We could argue this one all day. But Your sentence "SpamCop doesn't have 
the power, authority or ability to stop anyone from emailing anyone at any 
time" is VERY telling.

SpamCop bought to bear a product that they themselves WILLINGLY and FREELY 
admit is flawed. One that causes innocent people to be wrongly accused. 
Please do not insult my intelligence by telling me that they are not 
partially responsible for what happens.

Let's try it a different way here for a minute. How about I design a 
program that lets everybody and anybody misuse it, and file false spam 
complaints about you at will?

How would you feel then?

Is the person filing them at fault?

Is it me as the person who created the program at fault?

Or are we BOTH at fault?

Common sense dictates my answer to that question, and all the semantics and 
spin doctoring in the world will not change the facts.

One search of "SpamCop" in any search engine or forum should turn up enough 
horror stories of INNOCENT people getting the shaft to perhaps make you 
reevaluate your good will towards them.

The fact is, their tools are defective, and in fact are essentially useless 
- anybody can complain about anyone else, and SpamCop throws their hands up 
in the air and says "hey, we can't control what our users do".

Meanwhile - the professional spammer goes on unchecked. I know this to be 
true, because I report the same professional spammers to SpamCop, and they 
just keep on coming. Quite frankly, comparing them to credible and useful 
resources like whois is a REALLY, REALLY, REALLY big stretch, my friend.

If our boy Julian could come up with something that keeps the kiddie porn 
and the open relay crap from China coming into my box - while at the same 
time making damn sure that no one innocent gets hurt - then I will be the 
FIRST one to embrace and endorse him. I don't see it coming though, for 
some odd reason...

I appreciate the open dialogue we are having here, but we should just agree 
to disagree at this point. You won't change my views, and I am not going to 
try to change yours. Have a great day, all the same!

Frank

At 04:55 PM 4/10/2002 -0800, you wrote:

>SpamCop doesn't have the power, authority or ability to stop anyone from 
>emailing anyone at any time.  The fact that some ISP's, Web Hosts, and 
>List Hosts are lazy, careless, and insensitive to the needs of their 
>paying customers is not the fault of SpamCop.  It is these service 
>providers that are hurting innocent people, not SpamCop.
>
>The gripe I have with SpamCop is the anonymity of complaints.  I 
>understand their justification, but I don't agree with it.  I also don't 
>think that any responsible service provider should make any decision based 
>on a single anonymous complaint.  However, that is the problem with the 
>service providers... not SpamCop.
>
>If we receive an anonymous complaint from ANY source (and there are plenty 
>of other mechanisms for doing so) we take it with a grain of salt.  We'll 
>investigate, and try to help the publisher find and remove the subscriber, 
>but we're not going to discontinue service over a single anonymous 
>complaint.  If you're with a host or service, that would treat you that 
>way then I humbly suggest you find another service provider.
>
>>If Julian had a conscience, he would fix his sorry excuse for a solution 
>>to our mutual problem, and he would stop allowing innocent people to be 
>>reported. No excuse, no justification, no reasoning that you could 
>>possibly ever offer me is going to change that.
>
>I don't think any excuse, justification or reasoning is necessary.  Do you 
>propose that we disable whois and tracert too?  After all, people use 
>these tools and others to send erroneous or deliberately false reports as 
>well.  How do we stop idiots from making mistakes or false 
>accusations?   Should we just make it so difficult for the average 
>Internet user to report Spam, that most don't even bother?  Do you think 
>laws would have any better effect on that ISP in China?
>
>I just don't understand your reasoning that makes SpamCop responsible for 
>misuse of their tools.  Do we hold car manufacturers responsible for drunk 
>drivers?
>
>
>Bob Cortez
>Business and Affiliate Development Manager
>ListChannel.Com - Tune Into Your Email
>http://listchannel.com/lc/


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